Wow, one can point a liberal out of a crowd quickly. Long before Schools there were extremely intelligent people without degrees in a subject. The sad thing is, I am an independent photographer, a programmer, and a operations manager. None of which have much to do with HR in and of themselves, yet I still have a better grasp than the lawyer (cough) in the group.

Typical trick that if one does not have anything intelligent to say, they attack the person. If, lawyer, you had such wisdom, then that which you have educated us with would have been enough to discredit what I say.

In a debate, you either have facts that will make people listen to you, or attacks that will attempt people from listening to your opponent. I see you have chosen the latter.

@Staceyboy: LOL I am not sure why someone must have dedicated education in a subject to be correct. If one does there share of reading and listening, you can learn much.

@Mike R.

“he ones who frequent their “establishments” are the ones who are the most vocal against them in the news and other media. ”

I find this extremely hard to believe. I am adamantly against them and don’t visit them. Yes, you will have hypocrites with anything, but I don’t see people talking against them and visiting them. It would be like screaming against abortions while at a clinic getting one done. Not going to be the norm.

I do agree that if it is legal (sadly) then it should have the protection as any other job.

I didn’t sink in the first time I read it, but you are right.

You answered a question with a question, but didn’t really give an answer other than to raise few sarcastic questions yourself. Erotica has long been argued as art by it’s many purveyors and the ‘Lawyers’ who purport that cause. As to whether a dancers ability to arouse someone sufficiently to relieve them of their money constitutes art, I don’t know and I suspect, neither do you. I would venture that for every lawyer you could find saying it wasn’t, I could find one that would say it was.

As far as requiring a planned routine or choreographing, I would argue that many strippers have a very well choreographed routine and even if they didn’t, the idea that all art is planned or choreographed is bunk. Change venues for a moment to music….Jazz is often free flowing and spontaneous. Would you discount it as art? I’m sure Miles Davis would disagree, if you did. How about, gee, I don’t know, painting. Does every painting need rough drafts and revisions before it can be called art? I think the great impressionist painter Claude Monet, were he alive, would disagree if you said yes.

Finally, I wonder at your choice of username….’Lawyer’. Did you choose it because you are so pompous as to tout your accomplishment, hoping to be the big fish in a little pond? Or, did you select it because of how inadequate you feel and you believed this would give you credibility? Either way, you came short of ’solving’ this dilema for us and provided no difinitve answers…maybe you could do a little research before you weigh in next time. Might help debunk that stereotype that Lawyers are 10% fact and 90% bull.

Richard, you strike me as having a pretty good understanding (I.E. Horse sense) for HR issues. How does being an independent photographer discount that?

Why would a stripper be a creative professional under the FLSA? How are the dances or entertainment they provide artistic? I.e., how are they different than the way many non-artist women dance at bars, clubs, weddings, etc.? What type of creative artistic experience is required? Or training? Do many exotic dancers train at Julliard?

Responding to “[i]f they aren’t, who would be?” – a dancer whose dancing is artistic (think Cirque de Soleil, ballet, or any of the backups in a dancing-related reality show that requires sophisticated choreographing).

@Richard Getz

As an independent photographer, what type of FLSA/HR background do you have?

I agree that it sounded very odd and stated that to her. She says that it was verified. The company is Hooters.

Thanks for the feedback.

Tipped employees (waitresses, etc) are subject to minimum wage and overtime requirements under both state and federal law. We employers are required to make sure they make at least minimum wage through a combination of cash wages (minimum wage minus a tip credit which currently nets to $2.13 per hour in NC) and tips. We have to pay the cash wage no matter how much they receive in tips and we have to make up the difference for those who don’t make enough in tips to get up to minimum wage. I can’t see any way that your friend’s employer could legally not pay her if she made over a certain amount in tips UNLESS the related payroll taxes or any other authorized deductions ate up the rest of her check. We are required to withhold income, social security and medicare taxes on the total wage amount including tips, so sometimes a wait person will receive a net zero check.

We are also required by both state and federal law to pay overtime to tipped employees. While we rarely have wait staff who work over 40 hours per week in that job alone, in our restaurant they sometimes also perform cashier, host or other duties. If their wait hours occur later in the week and are what puts them into overtime, we must pay them time and one-half of the minimum wage rate for those hours, less the tip credit (currently a net cash wage of $5.41)

In Nevada, prostitution is legal. In most states, exotic dancing is legal.

As a final note, I personally know some people who own “Gentleman’s clubs.” I don’t go there because it doesn’t do much for me. However, neither does going to a casino. My friends inform me that the ones who frequent their “establishments” are the ones who are the most vocal against them in the news and other media. Imagine that. Maybe if those who are indignant would quit going to these places, there would not be so many around. Its “Demand” and “Supply.”

If these ‘gentlemen’ go there to watch dancers, then yes, they are no better. Both are getting sexually aroused from girls (i presume) that are selling their bodies for CA$H!

I don’t go, nor understand strip clubs. If you throw that kind of money at your honey and act like you really want to be with her, she just might just be willing to hit that lap dance every now and again.