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	<title>Comments on: How honest are you? Take this test</title>
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		<title>By: JMF</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30856</link>
		<dc:creator>JMF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Oct 2009 01:55:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I agree with Tim; 1, 4, 1.  You should have the same rules for yourself at work and at home.  It&#039;s time for the government and the business world to remember honesty is always the right way to go.  If it had been the ruling way, we wouldn&#039;t all be in the mess we are in!  Our forefathers kept God in the equation; so should we.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Tim; 1, 4, 1.  You should have the same rules for yourself at work and at home.  It&#8217;s time for the government and the business world to remember honesty is always the right way to go.  If it had been the ruling way, we wouldn&#8217;t all be in the mess we are in!  Our forefathers kept God in the equation; so should we.</p>
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		<title>By: JRB</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30488</link>
		<dc:creator>JRB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:50:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Amen to that MKH!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amen to that MKH!!!</p>
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		<title>By: mkh</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30461</link>
		<dc:creator>mkh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:34:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30461</guid>
		<description>Sande,

Why so quick to excuse government for unethical conduct? It is not unethical to &quot;fail&quot; in pursuit of ones goals. It is unethical to lie and misrepresent yourself as having a particular goal, while not genuinely willing or interested in pursuing it. A politician&#039;s failure to meet a campaign promise, is not unethical, unless such failure is either due to failing to pursue or not actually holding the values related to the goal expressed. (false advertisement - lying to gain voters)

Unethical and illegal are not synonyms! For a politician to lie about his/her intentions is unethical, but not illegal. If you cannot prosecute for it (this includes official fines such as speeding tickets), it is not illegal. We do have scenarios arise in which unethical conduct was involved which identifies or results in the introduction of new law to make such conduct illegal, but the two are not the same.

Another example, it is unethical for siblings to be more interested in gaining control of the assets of their aging parents (for their own benefit), but in many cases can do so legally in spite of the unethical nature of such conduct.

If you limit your ethics to merely what is lawful, I would limit my trust in your conducting business of any nature on my behalf. It&#039;s akin to a child exceeding the evident guidance of the parents, and arguing, &quot;you didn&#039;t specifically say I couldn&#039;t&quot; even though the child knew the parent would not approve. Unethical, but not specifically illegal (violation of a formal law)

As for your comment that comparing government to private business is like comparing apples to oranges, I agree in the contrast, yet not in your conclusion from it. Government set rules for others and itself, and willfully enforces them while not applying those same rules to themselves. Businesses must heed the laws established by government, their own policies and principles of business and the industry. Oddly enough, in more cases than some would care to admit, businesses must choose which government rule to &#039;break&#039; as such rules may conflict with each other. If there is a place where ethics should be the easiest, it would be government. After all, what&#039;s the worst that can happen from being lawful and ethical; not getting re-elected. If that&#039;s the outcome, we should not be surprised at the absence of ethical and law-abiding politicians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sande,</p>
<p>Why so quick to excuse government for unethical conduct? It is not unethical to &#8220;fail&#8221; in pursuit of ones goals. It is unethical to lie and misrepresent yourself as having a particular goal, while not genuinely willing or interested in pursuing it. A politician&#8217;s failure to meet a campaign promise, is not unethical, unless such failure is either due to failing to pursue or not actually holding the values related to the goal expressed. (false advertisement &#8211; lying to gain voters)</p>
<p>Unethical and illegal are not synonyms! For a politician to lie about his/her intentions is unethical, but not illegal. If you cannot prosecute for it (this includes official fines such as speeding tickets), it is not illegal. We do have scenarios arise in which unethical conduct was involved which identifies or results in the introduction of new law to make such conduct illegal, but the two are not the same.</p>
<p>Another example, it is unethical for siblings to be more interested in gaining control of the assets of their aging parents (for their own benefit), but in many cases can do so legally in spite of the unethical nature of such conduct.</p>
<p>If you limit your ethics to merely what is lawful, I would limit my trust in your conducting business of any nature on my behalf. It&#8217;s akin to a child exceeding the evident guidance of the parents, and arguing, &#8220;you didn&#8217;t specifically say I couldn&#8217;t&#8221; even though the child knew the parent would not approve. Unethical, but not specifically illegal (violation of a formal law)</p>
<p>As for your comment that comparing government to private business is like comparing apples to oranges, I agree in the contrast, yet not in your conclusion from it. Government set rules for others and itself, and willfully enforces them while not applying those same rules to themselves. Businesses must heed the laws established by government, their own policies and principles of business and the industry. Oddly enough, in more cases than some would care to admit, businesses must choose which government rule to &#8216;break&#8217; as such rules may conflict with each other. If there is a place where ethics should be the easiest, it would be government. After all, what&#8217;s the worst that can happen from being lawful and ethical; not getting re-elected. If that&#8217;s the outcome, we should not be surprised at the absence of ethical and law-abiding politicians.</p>
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		<title>By: Sheryl</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30447</link>
		<dc:creator>Sheryl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 13:20:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30447</guid>
		<description>Rebecca:

Fellow southeastern Michigan HR Manager here.  Is your &quot;year end review&quot; a year-end recap on how they did, improvements for next year kind of session?  

Feel free to email me off list for ideas.  

~ Sheryl

sheryls@fiveonline.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rebecca:</p>
<p>Fellow southeastern Michigan HR Manager here.  Is your &#8220;year end review&#8221; a year-end recap on how they did, improvements for next year kind of session?  </p>
<p>Feel free to email me off list for ideas.  </p>
<p>~ Sheryl</p>
<p><a href="mailto:sheryls@fiveonline.com">sheryls@fiveonline.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Maggie</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30371</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:58:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30371</guid>
		<description>Tim and Al, I answered the same as you.  1-4-1.  I have been put in these situations and I don&#039;t let anyone influence me to do something that I find unethical.  I don&#039;t care how important the person is that I am talking to, they must own up to their own behavior.  If I am asked to do something unethical, I just say I won&#039;t and why.  I am not nasty or condescending.  I just take the right stand and live with it.  Once you start compromising your ethics, you are on a slippery slope.  In HR, your reputation is everything.  Once tarnished, it is hard to recover.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim and Al, I answered the same as you.  1-4-1.  I have been put in these situations and I don&#8217;t let anyone influence me to do something that I find unethical.  I don&#8217;t care how important the person is that I am talking to, they must own up to their own behavior.  If I am asked to do something unethical, I just say I won&#8217;t and why.  I am not nasty or condescending.  I just take the right stand and live with it.  Once you start compromising your ethics, you are on a slippery slope.  In HR, your reputation is everything.  Once tarnished, it is hard to recover.</p>
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		<title>By: Sande</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30367</link>
		<dc:creator>Sande</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:26:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30367</guid>
		<description>I agree with Al Gilmour...unethical will equate to illegal.  As far as what government and private practice does...it is comparing apples to oranges.  WE all tend to forget that our elected officials, from the County Commissioner to the President all make pledges and promises they cannot necessarily keep.  The majority rules.  So, whatever promises they make, the majority rules.  I would like to think that corporations choose to operate even more principled than government. They have a clear choice.  The scenarios presented, although optimistic, are probably far from what actually happens. Most people operating on a &quot;junior&quot; level are going to preserve &quot;self&quot; first.  Junior level executives are merely inching their way to the top.  They, for the most part, do not have enough &quot;juice&quot; to squeeze anyone higher than they are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Al Gilmour&#8230;unethical will equate to illegal.  As far as what government and private practice does&#8230;it is comparing apples to oranges.  WE all tend to forget that our elected officials, from the County Commissioner to the President all make pledges and promises they cannot necessarily keep.  The majority rules.  So, whatever promises they make, the majority rules.  I would like to think that corporations choose to operate even more principled than government. They have a clear choice.  The scenarios presented, although optimistic, are probably far from what actually happens. Most people operating on a &#8220;junior&#8221; level are going to preserve &#8220;self&#8221; first.  Junior level executives are merely inching their way to the top.  They, for the most part, do not have enough &#8220;juice&#8221; to squeeze anyone higher than they are.</p>
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		<title>By: JRB</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30354</link>
		<dc:creator>JRB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 19:45:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30354</guid>
		<description>Mike R: YOU ARE RIGHT! Most people have no clue as to how to define &quot;unethical&quot;. From my own experiences, being honest and blunt has gotten me into a few precarious situations. In my opinion, it is an outrage to think that standing your ground when it comes to right and wrong(no gray areas with me either) could be considered anything other than honest and upstanding. You would think that these are the people that companies would want as employees, but I think they see us as future problems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike R: YOU ARE RIGHT! Most people have no clue as to how to define &#8220;unethical&#8221;. From my own experiences, being honest and blunt has gotten me into a few precarious situations. In my opinion, it is an outrage to think that standing your ground when it comes to right and wrong(no gray areas with me either) could be considered anything other than honest and upstanding. You would think that these are the people that companies would want as employees, but I think they see us as future problems.</p>
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		<title>By: mike R</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30343</link>
		<dc:creator>mike R</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 18:05:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30343</guid>
		<description>I find that most people have no clue as to how to define what is &quot;ethical.&quot;  In the early 90&#039;s people were called &quot;unprofessional&quot;, but today we call them &quot;unethical.&quot;  Some define it by their &quot;gut&quot; feelings about a decision (I will know it when I see it).  Some define it by the rules of ethics, like a pre-legal system.  We live in a time of &quot;situational ethics&quot; where any manner of poor behavior can be explained away and rationalized.

There have been some excellent comments on this blog concerning exercises to explore ethical thinking and decision making.

One point I would like to make is that you can&#039;t distinguish a behavior as ethical or not through simple observation.  Some people do the &quot;right&quot; thing because they are not aware of any other options or by accident.

I find that ethical decisions involve not breaking faith with all the associations you might have.  For instance, I have found that some people have very strong family and community ties and they would betray their company, co-workers, and country if it came down to a choice between a family member and another.  Some have very strong religious ties and they would betray family, friends, and country to hold true to those beliefs.  Still there are others who have strong personal and professional ties and they would betray everyone to hold true to those standards.

It&#039;s not always a &quot;no brainer&quot; and sometimes involves doing the least harm.   We don&#039;t celebrate and reward ethical behavior.  It is expected from every group and association we belong to.  When we fall short, we get punished.

A Dr. Kohlberg discussed the process of moral development more than 30 years ago and identified three stages; Conformity, Choice, and Concern for others.  He identified that they were largely impacted by the community surrounding the individual.  For instance, in a small close-knit community moral development seems to stay at &quot;Conformity.&quot;  In large impersonal communities the moral development can develop to &quot;Choice.&quot; And finally, in communities where the people in authority communicate that they truly care, then the highest level of moral development &quot;Concern for others&quot; can develop.  So I guess, more that the rules and who is breaking them, if the leaders in our community do not make it a point to communicate their care and concern, we will be stuck with the situational &quot;what&#039;s in it for me&quot; choice stage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find that most people have no clue as to how to define what is &#8220;ethical.&#8221;  In the early 90&#8217;s people were called &#8220;unprofessional&#8221;, but today we call them &#8220;unethical.&#8221;  Some define it by their &#8220;gut&#8221; feelings about a decision (I will know it when I see it).  Some define it by the rules of ethics, like a pre-legal system.  We live in a time of &#8220;situational ethics&#8221; where any manner of poor behavior can be explained away and rationalized.</p>
<p>There have been some excellent comments on this blog concerning exercises to explore ethical thinking and decision making.</p>
<p>One point I would like to make is that you can&#8217;t distinguish a behavior as ethical or not through simple observation.  Some people do the &#8220;right&#8221; thing because they are not aware of any other options or by accident.</p>
<p>I find that ethical decisions involve not breaking faith with all the associations you might have.  For instance, I have found that some people have very strong family and community ties and they would betray their company, co-workers, and country if it came down to a choice between a family member and another.  Some have very strong religious ties and they would betray family, friends, and country to hold true to those beliefs.  Still there are others who have strong personal and professional ties and they would betray everyone to hold true to those standards.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not always a &#8220;no brainer&#8221; and sometimes involves doing the least harm.   We don&#8217;t celebrate and reward ethical behavior.  It is expected from every group and association we belong to.  When we fall short, we get punished.</p>
<p>A Dr. Kohlberg discussed the process of moral development more than 30 years ago and identified three stages; Conformity, Choice, and Concern for others.  He identified that they were largely impacted by the community surrounding the individual.  For instance, in a small close-knit community moral development seems to stay at &#8220;Conformity.&#8221;  In large impersonal communities the moral development can develop to &#8220;Choice.&#8221; And finally, in communities where the people in authority communicate that they truly care, then the highest level of moral development &#8220;Concern for others&#8221; can develop.  So I guess, more that the rules and who is breaking them, if the leaders in our community do not make it a point to communicate their care and concern, we will be stuck with the situational &#8220;what&#8217;s in it for me&#8221; choice stage.</p>
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		<title>By: ma</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30341</link>
		<dc:creator>ma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 17:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30341</guid>
		<description>Most of us whom have either taken the quiz honestly (lol) or read the scenarios and answers, are those who sit in higher positions and/ use experience and a greater level of evaluation towards these answers.  Most of you may have found yourself thinking back to when you may have entered a company as a Jr. Exec or in a Newbee role.  Perception is measured differently with everyone, but facts are facts, and in a court of law, facts will out weigh judgement and perception.  

We need to remember to use &#039;good&#039; judgement and exercise due dillegence when determining best practices for our employers.  As HR Professionals we are often placed in advisory positions, which require compromise yet decisive answers as to which way Management should go in deciding what is legal and compliant.  If we do not practice ethical goverance and sound business adherance what good is the role we serve for the organization.  

Many personnel are challenged with small and large decisions weekly, that could have a positve or adverse result on the company.  However, we need to consistently encourage personnel to be proactive, make decisions based on how they would want another individual in that position to respond, empower them to tell the truth from a business persepective (removing emotionally bias opinions) and provide factual evidence to support the argument or action.

All things considered, any given person could have went a combination of ways in choosing the best avenue to solve each scenario.  I always encourage Executive/Management Team to think first, if more than one option/side weigh the lesser of them, and then make a decision; however, be ready to flex and change if facts/proof prove to be detrimental with initial response. You should look at the corporate culture and provide a basis that puts each decision in a better position than its initial.  Above all remeber to use Integrity.

Just my 2 cents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Most of us whom have either taken the quiz honestly (lol) or read the scenarios and answers, are those who sit in higher positions and/ use experience and a greater level of evaluation towards these answers.  Most of you may have found yourself thinking back to when you may have entered a company as a Jr. Exec or in a Newbee role.  Perception is measured differently with everyone, but facts are facts, and in a court of law, facts will out weigh judgement and perception.  </p>
<p>We need to remember to use &#8216;good&#8217; judgement and exercise due dillegence when determining best practices for our employers.  As HR Professionals we are often placed in advisory positions, which require compromise yet decisive answers as to which way Management should go in deciding what is legal and compliant.  If we do not practice ethical goverance and sound business adherance what good is the role we serve for the organization.  </p>
<p>Many personnel are challenged with small and large decisions weekly, that could have a positve or adverse result on the company.  However, we need to consistently encourage personnel to be proactive, make decisions based on how they would want another individual in that position to respond, empower them to tell the truth from a business persepective (removing emotionally bias opinions) and provide factual evidence to support the argument or action.</p>
<p>All things considered, any given person could have went a combination of ways in choosing the best avenue to solve each scenario.  I always encourage Executive/Management Team to think first, if more than one option/side weigh the lesser of them, and then make a decision; however, be ready to flex and change if facts/proof prove to be detrimental with initial response. You should look at the corporate culture and provide a basis that puts each decision in a better position than its initial.  Above all remeber to use Integrity.</p>
<p>Just my 2 cents.</p>
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		<title>By: Forest Guider</title>
		<link>http://www.hrmorning.com/how-honest-are-you-take-this-test/comment-page-1/#comment-30336</link>
		<dc:creator>Forest Guider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 16:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hrmorning.com/?p=5838#comment-30336</guid>
		<description>Rebecca, 

Here&#039;s an idea for you... My company concentrates on training in improvisation and communication skills. Here is an exercise that teams have a great time with and also stimulates conversation. I don&#039;t know the specifics of your company but you&#039;ll get the idea. I think that team building games can be rolled into discussions then honed into great ideas and put into action. 

This exercise is fun, interactive and stimulates discussion about any topic you choose. 

A) World&#039;s worst. You can get teams together in large or small groups. Tell them that they are going to present the World&#039;s Worst presentation on how to (i.e.) solve patient malpractice lawsuits, World&#039;s Worst candidate interview, etc. (Each team should present the worst possible way to solve this problem.) The results are hysterical and a great way to break out of the norm. 

There are a lot of these kinds of exercises. Please contact me if you would like to discuss further - I am always happy to help and would love to establish relationships with those in the healthcare field. 

Thank you,
Forest Guider 

www.improvconsulting.com 
forestguider@improvconsulting.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rebecca, </p>
<p>Here&#8217;s an idea for you&#8230; My company concentrates on training in improvisation and communication skills. Here is an exercise that teams have a great time with and also stimulates conversation. I don&#8217;t know the specifics of your company but you&#8217;ll get the idea. I think that team building games can be rolled into discussions then honed into great ideas and put into action. </p>
<p>This exercise is fun, interactive and stimulates discussion about any topic you choose. </p>
<p>A) World&#8217;s worst. You can get teams together in large or small groups. Tell them that they are going to present the World&#8217;s Worst presentation on how to (i.e.) solve patient malpractice lawsuits, World&#8217;s Worst candidate interview, etc. (Each team should present the worst possible way to solve this problem.) The results are hysterical and a great way to break out of the norm. </p>
<p>There are a lot of these kinds of exercises. Please contact me if you would like to discuss further &#8211; I am always happy to help and would love to establish relationships with those in the healthcare field. </p>
<p>Thank you,<br />
Forest Guider </p>
<p><a href="http://www.improvconsulting.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.improvconsulting.com</a><br />
<a href="mailto:forestguider@improvconsulting.com">forestguider@improvconsulting.com</a></p>
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